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Table Of Contents
| 1. | 2004/12/05 - 2004/12/10 | (0 posts) | Ubuntu Conference Mega-Story |
| 2. | 2004/11/29 - 2004/12/09 | (44 posts) | Supporting Non-Free Software |
| 3. | 2004/12/03 - 2004/12/08 | (13 posts) | Kernel Security Update Woes |
| 4. | 2004/12/04 - 2004/12/07 | (35 posts) | GNOME Panel Structure in Hoary |
| 5. | 2004/12/04 - 2004/12/09 | (18 posts) | Editors in the Default Install |
| 6. | 2004/12/04 - 2004/12/07 | (8 posts) | Debug GNOME Packages |
| 7. | 2004/12/05 - 2004/12/14 | (56 posts) | KDE In Ubuntu - KUBUNTU! |
| 8. | 2004/12/06 | (0 posts) | Hoary Goals Summary BOF |
| 9. | 2004/12/07 - 2004/12/09 | (17 posts) | More on CD Creation |
| 10. | 2004/12/09 | (0 posts) | Documentation Team BOF |
| 11. | 2004/12/10 | (0 posts) | Ubuntu Marketing BOF |
| 12. | 2004/12/06 - 2004/12/09 | (3 posts) | The Open CD |
| 13. | 2004/12/04 - 2004/12/10 | (0 posts) | Ubuntu Security Notifications |
Introduction
Welcome to the sixteenth edition of Ubuntu Traffic. This issue covers the week of December 4, 2004 - December 10, 2004. Ubuntu Traffic summarizes the most important mailing list and IRC discussions involving the Ubuntu GNU/Linux distribution.
Ubuntu Traffic can be found on the web at http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~mako/ubuntu-traffic/. You can also receive in text form over email by signing up for the Ubuntu News mailing list at http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-news. There is now an RSS feed for traffic available as well! You can find information on turning that on at the Ubuntu Hompage.
You can sign up for any of the mailing lists summarized here at http://lists.ubuntu.com. You can also join the IRC discussion summarized here in #ubuntu and other channels on the Freenode network: irc.freenode.net. Please join in and maybe you will be featured in the next traffic!
Writing this traffic was a little bit of a handful. For the last five days of the week, all of the Canonical Team and many of the volunteers had descended upon Mataró, Catalonia, Spain for the long-awaited Ubuntu conference. There were over a dozens BOFs in this week alone and each of them seems worthy of full notes in the text of traffic. For reasons of space, I've highlighted a few BOFs which I thought were the most essential and then covered the rest of them in a big conference mega-story. Please click through to read the notes on the wiki where they are available for all topics you are interseted in.
First, the following bits and pieces didn't get a full story but are worth mentioning:
Santiago Erquicia posted to the -devel list to say, "The original idea of not having a firewall was that there were no open ports by default and if anyone wanted to install apache, for example, he/she had the necessary expertise to protect the system. Now, with gnome-user-share, we are going to end up with apache installed (by default?) but usually this is going to be used by "normal people" without knowledge for protecting the system. How is this going to done?"
Jeff Waugh replied to say, "we may not have gnome-user-share installed by default, and if we did, we may not have apache running or listening. Either way, nothing will listen by default, as per policy."
1.
Ubuntu Conference Mega-Story
2004/12/05 - 2004/12/10
(0 posts)
Subject: "[too many to keep track of]"
As I mentioned in the introduction, I've highlighted a few BOfs which I thought were the most essential and put them in full stories below. The rest are described here. Please read the notes on the wiki where they are available if you're interested (the links are in there).
Described a host of package management tools planned for hoary including:
There were a handful of other BOFs that did not have notes available at the time I wrote this. I've done my best to list those here. This list includes:
There was also a PGP Keysigning party organized by Benjamin Mako Hill and lots of Cambridge Standard Five-Card Mao, largely overseen by Daniel Silverstone, but their meetings did not produce notes.
2.
Supporting Non-Free Software
2004/11/29 - 2004/12/09
(44 posts)
Subject: "Idea for expanded support of some non-free software"
People:
Thully, Jeff Waugh
Thully posted a message to the ubuntu-devel list saying:
are some non-free software applications and file formats for which no viable free alternative exists, or the free alternative is severely crippled. Also, there is a lot of software that is free - but has patent or other legal issues. Some examples are:
- Flash - no good free player, but used on many web sites - non-free in multiverse
- MP3 support - patent issues - decoder in universe, encoder on third-party archives
- DVD support - CSS issues - all players in main archive, but DeCSS in third-party archive
Currently, this software is available only in universe/multiverse (at the best) or third-party archives (in the worst case). I feel that some of the above packages should be supported more than they are currently - as I had some problems with Flash etc and there seems to be no interest in fixing the issues since the packages are "non-free, thus unsupported".
Jeff Waugh replied to state, "Where non-free software is legally redistributable, it may b packaged and distributed through our unsupported multiverse repository. However, much of the software you've mentioned is not legally redistributable, however much we paper over the basic issue of it being non-free and unsupportable. :-)" Elsewhere Jeff reminded people that, "Spending time supporting proprietary software would detract from our ability to provide a great supportable and Free OS for everyone, which is our main objective"
3.
Kernel Security Update Woes
2004/12/03 - 2004/12/08
(13 posts)
Subject: "Kernel security update would break ABI"
People:
Martin Pitt, Oliver Grawert, Matt Zimmerman
Martin Pitt posted to say:
We currently have a dilemma regarding a Warty security update of the kernel.
There is a public vulnerability which affects the Warty kernel. We have a patch and could upload it any time, but this patch changes the ABI (Application Binary Interface). This should actually be unacceptable for a security update, but it is required to close the hole.
An ABI change has the following consequences:
- This would render d-i unbuildable on a security-patched Warty. However, according to Colin we can neglect that.
- It breaks compatibility with user-installed modules, which is the actual headache.
There are two possibilities of handling the module issue:
- Ignore the ABI change and hope that most of the user installed modules continue to work (but if they don't, this could cause a mess).
- Bump the version number, which renders all user-added modules unloadable. They have to be recompiled against the new kernel to work again.
Oliver Grawert suggested that, "I think the name should get changed, but a real big preinst/debconf warning for this package should show up (probably with a siren and a blinking desktop). to make sure the user notices the change, keep the upcoming support low and make the user feel ubuntu cares for him/her if such odd things happen (also a little explanation why all that happens would be cool)."
Matt Zimmerman replied saying:
This might be reasonable if the kernel packages already used debconf in preinst, but that would be far too big a change to introduce in a security update. We have had some breakage forced upon us by the nature of the bug, but we should try to keep it to a minimum.
This would be great to have implemented in linux-meta in Hoary, though.
Of course, somebody will need to work on this. Perhaps a good job for folks not yet actively involved in the project.
4.
GNOME Panel Structure in Hoary
2004/12/04 - 2004/12/07
(35 posts)
Subject: "Proposed panel menu structure for hoary"
People:
Jeff Waugh
Jeff Waugh sent a message describing, in depth, a series of changes that he wanted to make to the GNOME menu structure in particular saying:
The panel menu structure changes you see in warty were made late in the release process, so we didn't have much time to spend designing it for acceptance upstream, or optimal GNOME integration. What follows is a design that I hope will be acceptable upstream with minor modifications, and solve the challenges we've set for ourselves in Ubuntu. It was mostly fleshed out at the Oxford conference, so there's nothing particularly new here.
It's important to keep in mind that these changes are "long term temporary" in nature. That is, in the not too distant future, all of this stuff will change significantly upstream, so our goal here is to make sure what we do in the meantime is good, not perfect. :-)
The first major change in this proposal is the "Places" menu, which replaces the top chunk of warty's Computer menu. Here we give users fast, top-level access to their most commonly used folders, and attached storage devices.
Next we have a dynamic list of the attached storage devices, as listed in the Disks (aka computer:///) window. When you insert a USB stick or CD, you will see them listed here. The 'Network' item stays the same (it opens the network:/// window).
Finally, we have a 'System' menu. Suggestions welcome for a better name, as 'System' is remarkably generic. Another option is shifting this to an icon only menu at the top left (like the Apple menu in OS X). I'm not convinced it's important enough for that, however, but we could include some funkier stuff to make it so (longer discussion). Anyway, this menu covers global functions, such as desktop preferences and system configuration, help and support oriented functions, and logging out.
Lots more details and examples are included in Jeff's email to the ubuntu-devel list that started the thread. Many additional details were hashed out on the list.
5.
Editors in the Default Install
2004/12/04 - 2004/12/09
(18 posts)
Subject: "Slimming down default install?"
People:
Martin Alderson, Matt Zimmerman, Colin Watson
Martin Alderson posted to say that:
I notice that emacs, vim and pico/nano are installed by default. Surely the point of Ubuntu is to offer a flexible, feature complete 'base' and work on top of it. I highly commend you for having only one web browser, one office suite, one video player, one audio player - not the 4 of each that most other distros ship with.
I would suggest keeping pico (because it's the smallest) and get rid of emacs and vim. Those two take up around 20MB in my estimation, which is a lot of space that could be used for something else.
Anyone who uses emacs and vim anyway will have the knowledge to do sudo apt-get install vim and have it installed?
Matt Zimmerman replied to say:
In this instance, they are there for different use cases:
- nano is present to provide a basic text editing facility for recovery and diagnostic use, which anyone can easily learn and use
- vim is there for traditional UNIX reasons, to provide vi
- emacs is a programmer's editor
I think a case could be made for removing emacs from the default desktop install, but not the other two (which are part of base).
Responding to concerns that this was leading to bloat that would compromise the one-CD nature of Ubuntu, Colin Watson replied saying, "We have no intention of making Ubuntu require multiple CDs. We may start doing a DVD with all of main or something like that, but the single CD will remain an option. If we start to hit size limits, then we'll just have to work out what to leave out."
6.
Debug GNOME Packages
2004/12/04 - 2004/12/07
(8 posts)
Subject: "-dbg packages for major Gnome applications"
People:
Jerry Haltom, Michael Banck, Sebastien Bacher, Jeff Waugh
Jerry Haltom asked on the devel list, "It would perhaps be very useful to create -dbg packages for the common large Gnome applications: such as Evolution, Nautilus, Gnome-Panel, etc. I tend to have these guys crash out on me fairly regularly, but every time I do, I had forgotten to rebuild my "nostrip" version, so I can never catch where. It's a bit tedious to track upgrades to all these applications, rebuilding them on my own. I would bet we'd get some more useful debug information from bug-buddy crashes if installing symbols was easier."
In response, Michael Banck suggested:
You could perhaps also just ship GNOME packages built with debugging symbols during the development process (like God^WRMS intended) and then rebuild the final packages for the release without them.
Or have an autobuilt hoary-debug archive users can ping higher than hoary. Again, just for GNOME packages.
Sebastien Bacher replied saying that, "I've already thought about that, but debugging packages are huge to download and devel branch change a lot ... not sure than people would be happy to get such big upgrade only for debugging purpose." He also thought the second suggestion made a lot of sense. Jeff Waugh replied to say, "dbg packages in normal hoary would be great. If something is breaking, you can just pull down the appropriate dpkg package and go. :-)"
7.
KDE In Ubuntu - KUBUNTU!
2004/12/05 - 2004/12/14
(56 posts)
Subject: "Ubuntu KDE"
People:
Henry Keultjes, Emil Oppeln-Bronikowski, Chris Halls
One of the big threads on the list this week was about a KDE version of Ubuntu. KDE is already in Universe in Ubuntu but the distribution has a strong focus on GNOME and cannot support both projects.
Henry Keultjes asked on ubuntu-users: "Anyone interested in putting an UbuntuPPC version without Gnome and with KDE together for use here in the USA?"
Emil Oppeln-Bronikowski announced that he would like to help, "but not as a fork(); from Ubuntu, because Ubuntu devs are outstanding and understanding people. I could help with polishing KDE for Ubuntu." Chris Halls replied saying:
Perfect. Andreas & I are now fully fledged Ubuntu developers and we making uploads to the Ubuntu archive. The archive structure WRT main/universe for Kubuntu may change in the future as the 'derivative distribution' infrastructure is finalised, but our KDE packages are not a fork as you perhaps imply. There are no Ubuntu KDE packages as such - the non-ubuntu packages that you see in universe are simply (unsupported) automatic imports from Debian.
As a guide, those KDE packages with an ubuntu version suffix are the beginnings of Kubuntu. We may be able to change that suffix to Kubuntu. Elmo says the archive infrastructure can cope but I'll ask around a bit more first.
If you'd like to start tweaking the 3.3.2 packages please go ahead. Andreas & I will be busy for a while just getting everything uploaded.
More discussions about the project to build a KDE version of Ubuntu, called Kubuntu, went on in Mataró. There's not a lot to report yet but it's being driven by Chris Halls and Andreas Mueller who are both new Ubuntu developers and have experience with KDE work in Debian.
8.
Hoary Goals Summary BOF
2004/12/06
(0 posts)
Subject: "Hoary Goals Summary BOF"
BOF Notes: htttp://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/HoaryGoalsSummary
Matt Zimmerman and Jeff Waugh ran a BOF on the goals for Hoary. The notes that they left the BOF with included a short of hit list:
Primary Goals:
Secondary Goals:
The updated list of Hoary Goals is online here: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/HoaryGoals
It's where you should look for update to date information on the goals and how things are going with them.
9.
More on CD Creation
2004/12/07 - 2004/12/09
(17 posts)
Subject: "Creating audio CDs in Hoary."
People:
Lex Hider, Jeff Waugh
Lex Hider posted a message to the devel list saying,
I'm sure I'm not Robinson Crusoe in wanting a GUI solution for creating and copying audio CDs in Ubuntu. What are the plans for supporting this in Hoary [if not Hoary, Hoary+1,2, etc].
As I see it there are 3 main options:
- Do nothing.
- Include k3b in desktop seed.
- Include a gtk/gnome app that will create audio CDs.
Jeff Waugh replied to say, "With regards to point 3 (which is really the only viable option), it would be great if we had Coaster packages to test now that it is in more active development. It will probably won't make it into the Desktop seed for Hoary, but at least we could try it from universe and test it for future use."
10.
Documentation Team BOF
2004/12/09
(0 posts)
Subject: "Documentation Team BOF"
BOF Notes:
These two BOFs, led by Enrico Zini, Benjamin Mako Hill, Sivan Green and others each covered a lot of ground and they ran into each other. If your interested in catching up with what the documentation team is doing, these are good places to start. For those that just want to see the documentation goals, those included:
We have a couple major ideas that are goals include:
The Ubuntu Quick Start Guide (in a Nutshell) (the pocket book) - The basic install overview - overview of applications - how to join the community - something around ~6000 words + loads of pictures and screenshots
This should be done by week 23 (two weeks before the preview freeze).
The About Ubuntu page should be threshed out and such (this is a small one).
Secondary goals include:
11.
Ubuntu Marketing BOF
2004/12/10
(0 posts)
Subject: "Ubuntu Marketing BOF"
BOF Notes: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UbuntuMarketing
Benjamin Mako Hill and Jeff Waugh led a super-BOF where we covered a ton of different ideas for how we can more effectively market Ubuntu. Check the notes for all the great details. There were many ideas but we voted on these and selected five top items that may have budgets available and will be able to do good things. These include:
Lots more of the good info is available on the website.
12.
The Open CD
2004/12/06 - 2004/12/09
(3 posts)
Subject: "Ubuntu marketing: TheOpenCD 2.0"
People:
Henrik Nilsen Omma
It's not a purely Ubuntu issue but a version of the Open CD were shipped on the Ubuntu Live CD. Open CD developer and Ubuntu developer Henrik Nilsen Omma said:
As some of you may be aware, The Open CD and Ubuntu are entering into an extensive collaboration these days. The Ubuntu Live CD contains a small selection of Windows-FOSS presented in a browser based on The Open CD. The next major release of TheOpenCD, scheduled for this week, will contain a brief introduction to Ubuntu Linux (the target audience for this disc is average Windows users).
A preview can be found here: http://theopencd.sunsite.dk/preview/
Please take it for a spin and let me know if you find any errors (spelling, factual, broken links, etc.) Thanks. (Either use this email or stop by our forums at: http://theopencd.sunsite.dk/forum/ ) And once the ISO is ready you might want to pass it around to your Windows-based friends to introduce them to both FOSS generally and Ubuntu specifically.
13.
Ubuntu Security Notifications
2004/12/04 - 2004/12/10
(0 posts)
Subject: "[n/a]"
There were no Ubuntu Security Notifications posted this week.
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